499Block 在线访谈第 21 期 | Facebook 法律顾问 Omer 讲述 Libra 听证会后,Libra 能否突破监管重围?

2019年10月14日 16:17

摘 要


“Libra 的横空出世,会带动更多的交易场景涌现,很可能把全世界十亿级以上人口引向通往投资数字资产世界的大门。重新看看世界,在未来可预期的时间里,加密数字资产一定会有更加广阔的市场基础。**

_《在线访谈》21 期访谈实录:_

访·谈·来·啦·

Grace:今天很高兴邀请到 Facebook 法律顾问 Omer
Ozden。首先,让我介绍一下今天的嘉宾:欧阳默,石木资本创始人兼 CEO、RockTree LEX 创始人、美国国会小组 (Congressional
Caucus) 成员、Facebook 法律顾问、国际证券律师、中国⾸批国际技术风险投资和知识产权交易律师,纽约贝克•麦坚时律师事务所的合伙人 ,
优客工场及共享际的联合创始人 ,
曾与网易,阿里巴巴,百度,新东⽅教育集团,尚德太阳能,艺龙等公司合作,2000 年加入硅谷最大的律师事务所之一的美富律师事务所。

Firstly,let me introduce our guest,Omer Ozden. Chairman & Founder of RockTree
Capital; Chairman & Founder of RockTree LEX; Member of the U.S Congressional
Caucus; Facebook Legal Counsel. International securities lawyer, the lawyer on
some of China’s very first international technology VC and IPOs transactions,
partner with Baker & McKenzie LLP in New York and co-founder of UrWork and
5LMeet, worked with NetEase, Alibaba, Baidu, New Oriental, Suntech, E-Long
etc., joined Morrison & Foerster LLP (MoFo),one of the top Silicon Valley Law
Firms in 2000.Welcome Omer Ozden.

Omer Ozden大家好。

Hello everyone.

Grace:好的,让我们进入今天的主题。在美国众议院金融服务委员会对专家小组的采访中,CoinShares 的首席战略官 Meltem
Demirors 说 Libra 并不是真正的加密货币。国会真的理解 Libra 和加密货币之间的区别吗?

All right, let's move on to today's topic. During the U.S. House Financial
Services Committee’s interview of a panel of experts, CoinShares CSO Meltem
Demirors said that Libra was not really a crytocurrency. Does the Congress
really understand the difference between Libra and Cryptocurrency?

Omer OzdenMeltem
是我的好朋友,我们一起做了很多区块链行业投资,她也是在同行 5 人专家组中最懂 BTC 和加密货币的。她是真正的加密货币专家和投资者。Meltem 在国会听证时说 Libra 不是真正的加密货币:1.
中心化;2.
许可式。在我和国会及参议院讨论时,我发现,他们根本不懂加密货币。但我不能以偏概全,因为他们中很多人还是很博学的。国会的人很聪明,他们知道这次听证会的主题是 Facebook 的 LIBRA,而不是加密货币。他们知道这两者是不一样的 ...... 我的谈话以及我与国会和参议院的闭门讨论都很好地体现了这一点。国会成员都比较年轻,参议院成员年纪相对大一些。所以国会对新科技及其未来影响会了解的更深入一些。所以,可以说国会比参议院更酷。

Meltem is my good friend. We have made a lot of investments in blockchain
together. She is the most knowledgeable one in BTC and cryptocurrency among
the five experts. She is truly a crypto currency expert and investor. Meltem
said in a congressional hearing that Libra is not a real cryptocurrency: 1.
Centralization; 2. Permitted. When I discussed with House of Representatives
and the Senate, I found that they didn't understand cryptocurrencies at all.
But it’s partial to deny all of them, because many are still very
knowledgeable. Congress was smart enough to know that the hearings were about
Facebook's LIBRA and not about cryptocurrencies. The Congress knew that these
two are different..... which was very good to see in my talks and closed-door
discussions with Congress and Senate over that week. Members of the House of
Representatives are relatively young, while members of the Senate are
relatively older. So the House of Representatives will understand more about
new technologies and their future impact. In this way, the House of
Representatives is more cool than the Senate.

Grace:国会是否担心 Facebook”规模太大而不能失败”?

Does Congress be worried about Facebook being “Too big to fail”?

Omer Ozden
国会和参议院不是担心 Facebook 规模大而不能失败,他们担心的是 Facebook 太大。Facebook 有 27 亿用户,现在正在创造一种世界货币。如果不是 Facebook 来做,那么 Google、亚马逊、腾讯、telegram 也会去做,这是未来发展趋势。美国政府也知道这一点,所以他们对此事非常严肃。现在全世界都开始关注加密货币了,在 David
Marcus 的讲话中,我们了解到两点主要信息:1.这是一种创新 2. 这是必然趋势。顺便说一句,我们都认为 David
Marcus 在听证会上表现得非常好。他训练有素,答起问题来就像律师一样,措辞谨慎,掷地有声。

The houses’ concern is “too big” rather than “too big to fail”. Facebook has
2.7 billion users and is now creating a global currency, which, if not
Facebook, would be initiated by Google, Amazon, Tencent, and telegram. It is
the trend for future development. The US government knows it well and treats
it seriously. The entire world is waking up to Cryptocurrencies now. For David
Marcus, the main message we had him say is: 1. It is Innovation. 2. It is
inevitable. By the way, we all think David Marcus did VERY well in the
hearings. He was trained to answer the questions just like a lawyer. Very
carefully. and very powerfully.

Grace:当马库斯和专家小组在听证会上谈起比特币时,国会的反应怎么样?

What’s the reaction of Lawmakers when Marcus and the expert panel invoke
Bitcoin during the hearings?

Omer Ozden谈论 BTC 最多的人是 Meltem。她告诉我,她尝试在听证中说 100 次 BTC,相反,David
Marcus 尽量避免在说 BTC。我和 Tom
Emmer 开了很多会,他是国会区块链会议的众议员联席会议员。他是 BTC 狂热爱好者,也很懂得 BTC 的力量。我和 Tom
Emmer 多次会面,讨论如何在美国为加密货币制定新的法律。一起开会的还有 Darren
Soto,他也是国会区块链会议的联合主席,我们正在美国起草新的法律……这将最终影响世界。

Meltem talked about BTC the most. She told me that she tried to mention BTC
for a hundred times in the hearing, while David Marcus shed away from BTC as
much as possible. I have had a lot of meetings with Tom Emmer, a joint member
of the House of Representatives of the Congressional Conference on Blockchain.
He is a BTC fanatic and knows the power of BTC. I met Tom Emmer several times
to discuss how to make new laws for cryptocurrencies in the United States. We
were joined by Darren Soto, who is also co-chair of the Congressional
Conference on Blockchain. We are drafting new laws in the United States...and
it will make a global impact.

Grace:随着 Libra 的立法程序启动,消费者的数据和隐私保护将成为首要焦点。在您看来,Libra 是否会承诺负责任地管理用户数据?

As the legislative process around Libra begins, the consumer data and privacy
protection will be the major focuses. In your aspect, Whether Libra will
commit to manage user data responsibly?

Omer Ozden
当前美国政府并不青睐 Facebook。因为后者在保护用户隐私方面做得不好。由于这个原因,他们刚刚向 Facebook 处以了 50 亿美元的罚款。

The US Government right now does NOT like Facebook. Because of Privacy issues.
They fined Facebook $5,000,000,000 just now because of this.

Grace:美国国会议员 Andy
Barr 说:“如果发展中国家采用 Libra 而不是美元,那么 Libra 肯定会破坏这些发展中国家的中央银行的业务和货币政策,Libra 会影响到其所“支持”的一系列货币吗?

The Congressman Andy said “Libra would definitely disrupt the central banking
and monetary policy in these developing countries, if they “Libra-lize’
instead of “Dollar-ize”. Will Libra impact the currencies by which it is
“Backed”?

Omer Ozden
是的,美国政府对此很担心,他们担心美元在全球经济中的主导地位。他们并不担心在 Libra 对其支持的一系列货币的影响。但国会,特别是参议院最喜欢的一件事是加密货币甚至 Libra 可以帮助穷人。

Yes, the US government is concerned about this. They are worried about the
dollar's dominance in the global economy rather than impact of Libra on the
currencies it supports. But one thing Congress and ESPECIALLY the Senate likes
is that Cryptocurrencies and even Libra will help poor people。

Grace:Libra 自己都缺乏可识别的认证,怎么帮助无银行账户的群体呢?

How can Libra do help the unbanked when they are lack of identifiable proof of
identification?

Omer Ozden加密货币会帮助没有银行账户的人, Maxine Waters 和我专门强调了这一点。所以她也很支持加密货币 ,
包括 Trey Hollingsworth 和 Bill
Foste。当然,无银行账户群体仍然拥有 ID,他们仍然可以买得起 40 美元的手机而且可以获得一个电话号码。问题是银行不愿意把这些低收入人群纳入客户群体,因为对银行来讲没有利润。但是每个人都知道用 BTC 交易有多方便快捷,所以政府需要每一个使用加密的人都有自己的身份,即使低收入人群,也是有 ID 的。KYC 和 AML 对美国政府很重要,所以美国政府希望人们使用个人身份认证来使用加密货币。

It will help the Unbanked. i.e the poor people who are not rich enough to have
a bank account. Maxine Waters told me this very specifically... in this way,
she supports crypto. so did Trey Hollingsworth and Bill Foster. these are the
key people in US government for Crypto. The Unbanked still have ID. The poor
people can still afford a $40 cell phone and to get a number, you usually need
an ID. The problem is that no bank wants to support these people because they
can't make profit from them. But as EVERYONE here knows...... Bitcoin costs
only $0.02 or 0.03 to send a small amount of money and even for BIG money, it
is still very cheap. KYC and AML is very important for the US Government.
That's why they want people onboarded with proper Identification to use
Crypto.

Grace:目前美国与中国等国之间的局势十分紧张,鉴于此,Facebook 会加强加密货币的“军备竞赛”吗?

Along with current international tensions between the US and countries like
China, will Facebook raise the crypto arms race?

Omer Ozden
毫无疑问,Facebook 提高了加密货币的“军备竞赛”。Coindesk 在听证期间采访了我,我告诉他们 7 月对加密货币非常重要。因为在 7 天的听证会中,最强大的政府都发表了关于加密货币的重要声明,包括美国总统 Trump、英国领导、中国人民银行领导、美国议会和国会,同时还有世界上其他的政府。本月对于区块链和加密技术非常重要,就像披萨日一样重要!Facebook 让所有的科技公司、投资银行、商业银行和世界领导理解了两件事:1.
加密货币是不可避免的趋势;2.
加密货币必须被支持,走的慢的会被甩在后面。因为区块链技术发展迅猛。中国有一句话是这样表述的:币圈一天,人间一年。区块链技术日新月异,
现在他们都知道这一点了。瑞士,日本,欧盟,新加坡和中国都了解了这一点。中国速度一直很快,中国政府很了解科技的力量。中国人民银行发表了官方声明,表明将密切关注加密技术。

There is no doubt that Facebook has raised the "arms race" of
cryptocurrencies. Coindesk interviewed me during the hearing and I told them
that July is very important for cryptocurrencies. Because in 7 days, the most
powerful government issued solemn statements about crypto, including US
President Donald Trump, British leader, leader of the People's Bank of China,
US Congress and other governments in the world. This month was just as
important for blockchain and crypto as Pizza Day! Facebook has forced all the
tech companies, all the investment banks, all the commercial banks, and all
the world leaders to understand two things. 1. Cryptocurrencies are here and
inevitable. 2. Cryptocurrencies MUST be embraced. Or those that go slowly will
get left behind. Because blockchain technology moves VERY FAST. I told
Congress and Senate: one day in the coin community equals to a year in the
human society. Blockchain moves very fast. They all now Know this. So does
Switzerland, Japan, EU, Singapore, and so does China. Chinese moves very fast
and the China government understands the importance of technology. People's
Bank of China made official statements about how they must pay close attention
to crypto.

Grace:在国会通过立法之前,Facebook 是否会停止开发该项目?

Whether Facebook would halt development on the project until Congress passed
legislation?

Omer Ozden
我们 7 月 30 号会在新加坡举办针对亚洲市场加密货币与传统银行间的高端闭门会,届时会有 SEC 和 Trump 总统特别顾问,中国人民银行,日本银行,韩国银行,泰国银行等国家级银行出席会议,越来越多的传统金融机构会加紧步伐进入加密货币领域,传统金融机构也深知时间紧迫。由于时间紧迫,今天我只能问以上几个问题,谢谢 Omer 先生,感谢您的精彩回答!

On July 30th, we will hold a high-end closed-door meeting in Singapore to
discuss cryptocurrencies and traditional banking in Asia. Participants include
SEC members, special advisers to the President Trump and leaders of the
People's Bank of China, Bank of Japan, Bank of Korea, Bank of Thailand and
other national banks. Because of the time, I can only ask these questions
today. Thank you Omer for your excellent answers!

Grace:中国政府很了解科技的力量。

The Chinese government knows the power of technology well.

Omer Ozden大家要加油喽!谢谢 499 加油站的各位!

Take care everyone. Thank you to 499 Girls!

Grace:谢谢 Omer 先生,感谢您的精彩回答!

Thank you Omer for your excellent answers!



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